Beehan, Tom

              
ORAL HISTORY OF TOM BEEHAN
Interviewed by Keith McDaniel
March 30, 2016
 
MR. MCDANIEL: This is Keith McDaniel and today is March 30, 2016. I'm at my studio here in Oak Ridge, with Tom Beehan. Tom, thank you for coming by and talking with us.
MR. BEEHAN: Well, Keith, this is a pleasure. You know, it’s a great project you're doing. I support it 200 percent. Only in a town like Oak Ridge would you have something like this, so I'm glad to be here.
MR. MCDANIEL: That's exactly right. As a matter of fact, it's one of the, to date, it is become one of the largest oral history collections in the country, and by far the largest on the DOE [Department of Energy] sites.
MR. BEEHAN: Oh, yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: So, we're very proud of it. I want to start, you've not always been an Oak Ridger, and I want to start before you came to Oak Ridge and learn something about you.
MR. BEEHAN: All right.
MR. MCDANIEL:  So, why don't we start at the beginning. Why don't you tell me something about where you were born and raised, something about your family?
MR. BEEHAN: Ok, yeah, well I was born and raised in Nashville, Tennessee. I have Irish and Swiss background. My dad was a police officer in Nashville. He was a sergeant, and he ended up being Sergeant of Arms. My mother was a bookkeeper, and she worked, worked at The Stockyards. So, if you've ever been to the restaurant, The Stockyards, that's where she worked.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh.
MR. BEEHAN: I went to Catholic schools in Nashville. I graduated from Father Ryan High School. A lot of people probably will know a little bit about that. It was for boys, at the time. It's now co-ed. After that, I went to Northern Kentucky, to Covington, to study to be a Catholic priest for the diocese of Nashville.
MR. MCDANIEL: Ok, let's, let's go back to Nashville, just a little bit.
MR. BEEHAN: All right. Yeah, right.
MR. MCDANIEL: Did you have any brothers or sisters?
MR. BEEHAN: Yes, yes, I did. I have three sisters. They're ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: ... all younger.
MR. MCDANIEL: Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: They are all, well, let's see two of them are still in Nashville. One of them has the family disease, she was on Metro Council. The other one's a social worker. And I have a sister in Louisville.
MR. MCDANIEL: Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: So, I'm the oldest, and I ended up, ended up here.
MR. MCDANIEL: Where did you ... where did you grow up in Nashville? Where did you live?
MR. BEEHAN: I lived on Blair Boulevard, which is in the, close to the Hillsboro Village.
MR. MCDANIEL: Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: So, it was, it was interesting, because that house is still there and we visited it  -- I won't get into that -- but it was a classic, I think, immigration-type of situation. My grandmother lived with us, too, so you had different generations. You don't see that much anymore ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: ... because people scatter. But she was from Ireland, and her sisters were and they all lived close by. My mother's spouse -- not spouse -- her siblings were close by so, we had all of these cousins and a whole ... And what's interesting, one of my mother's brother was a Catholic priest.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, is that right?
MR. BEEHAN: So, my wife, Kay, says I had no choice, you know, the oldest son in an Irish Catholic family. 
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: It was, like, pre-ordained that you would go away to study to be a Catholic priest, which is what I did.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure. The ... So, the ... So, you grew up, I imagine, in the '60s ...
MR. BEEHAN: I did.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... in Nashville.
MR. BEEHAN: I did. I went to Father Ryan, which was one of the first integrated schools in the country. We just celebrated the 50th year, the first time a black school played a, what ended up being a mixed, you know, integrated, basketball team, so I was very proud of that.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure.
MR. BEEHAN: One of my basketball, football coaches, was a guy by the name of John Seigenthaler.
MR. MCDANIEL: Is that right?
MR. BEEHAN: Siggy coached, and we've been friends, family friends, for a long, long time. As you, as you well know, he ended up being The Tennessean's publisher ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Publisher.
MR. BEEHAN: ... and started the First Amendment Center at the, at Vanderbilt University.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right. And didn't he just pass away here, not too long ago?
MR. BEEHAN: He did, he did.
MR. MCDANIEL: A few years ago, I think.
MR. BEEHAN: Well, it was, it was about a year ago really ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, was it. Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: ... because I watched it, I watched it on my computer ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: ... the funeral, because, I mean, I knew a lot of the people.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, sure, sure, absolutely ... The ... So, so your father was a police officer. I mean, do you remember any, any turbulent times in the '60s?
MR. BEEHAN: Oh, yeah. Absolutely.
MR. MCDANIEL: I mean, in Nashville.
MR. BEEHAN: I went to the seminary and I dropped out because, obviously, you know, I'm not a priest.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: I came home and I lived, and I taught in Nashville, at St. Henry's School. It was time, during the, the time, for instance, the night that Martin Luther King was killed, and he was in Memphis. My sister, Ilene, was over at, I forgot, what's the name of the, the all black school in Nashville? Tennessee ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Hume?
MR. BEEHAN: No, no, high -- college?
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, oh, Fisk?
MR. BEEHAN: Not Fisk. The other, the state one.
MR. MCDANIEL: East Tennessee ...
MR. BEEHAN: Tennessee.
MR. MCDANIEL: Tennessee State.
MR. BEEHAN: Tennessee State.
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: She was there. They were going to give her a scholarship. So, I went over to get her. That was scary. But my dad was part of the riot squads and ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, really?
MR. BEEHAN: ... and I still remember seeing the National Guard drive down our street. It was, it was a kind of crazy, crazy time.
MR. MCDANIEL: You know, it's interesting that you, that you would mention that. Just on a side note: I interviewed a lady who was a school teacher at Linden Elementary School for many, many years, and she said that -- this was back when they did this kind of things -- the classes would get on a bus, and be gone all day, and they'd take trips around the state. A class had gone to Nashville ...
MR. BEEHAN: Oh, my God ...
MR. MCDANIEL: ... to the state capitol, the day that Martin Luther King had, was shot.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: And they were on their way back and, of course, nobody had cell phones back then ...
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... or anything, and the parents were all worried. You know, they wanted to make sure that the kids got home safe before anything could, could happen, you know. 
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: So ... a group of Oak Ridge kids were in ...
MR. BEEHAN: Wow ...
MR. MCDANIEL: ... in Nashville that day.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah, it was kind of conflicting to me, because, well, I was in the seminary at the time, where, I wasn't conflicted. I was very much in favor of integration, and civil rights. And my dad, he had to go out and protect people.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure.
MR. BEEHAN: So, it was really kind of, and, of course, I didn't want to see him hurt.
MR. MCDANIEL: Of course.
MR. BEEHAN: We listened to the police monitors a lot.
MR. MCDANIEL: I bet you did. So, so, you left Nashville, and you went to Covington, Kentucky, to, to Catholic seminary?
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah. Now, here, here's the ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: I went to the seminary there ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: … for four years and went to theology in Baltimore, Maryland. That's where I really did a lot of… I went to the prison there, where I prayed, played music a lot, you may know that.
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah, right.
MR. BEEHAN: So, then I came home to Nashville, and taught for two years at St. Henry School.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right
MR. BEEHAN: And I needed ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Was that where you had gone?
MR. BEEHAN: No, no ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, ok, that was ... ?
MR. BEEHAN: Cathedral. It's an elementary. And then, I went, I needed to get a Master's degree. Xavier, in Cincinnati, would take all my seminary credits, so then, I moved to Cincinnati, where I'd been in the seminary, and reconnected with a lot of folks there.
MR. MCDANIEL: Were you still intending to become a priest?
MR. BEEHAN: No, no, no, no. I was married then.
MR. MCDANIEL: Ok, ok. 
MR. BEEHAN: I'm sorry.
MR. MCDANIEL: All right.
MR. BEEHAN: I'm sorry, I was married then.
MR. MCDANIEL: All right, Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: So, I went up there to go to Cincinnati ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: ... and to go to Xavier. And I ended up staying, 'bout 18 years. (laughs)
MR. MCDANIEL: Well, did you, did you get your Master's degree?
MR. BEEHAN: I never did. Lacked three hours of a Masters. Isn't that horrible?
MR. MCDANIEL: And what would that have been in?
MR. BEEHAN: Guidance and counseling. 
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, ok, all right.
MR. BEEHAN: I've used some of those skills through my life, though.
MR. MCDANIEL: I bet on, I bet on City Council you do.
MR. BEEHAN: Particularly on City Council. (laughter) 
MR. MCDANIEL: So ...
MR. BEEHAN: The listening and repeating back and, maybe, trying to figure out ... 
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: But anyway, that's a whole other story.
MR. MCDANIEL: So you, so you went back to Cincinnati, to Xavier, to get your ...
MR. BEEHAN: Right.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... to finish in ...
MR. BEEHAN: And then, I'd, well, I'd worked for non-profits in Cincinnati.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, ok.
MR. BEEHAN: I worked for the Lung Association and they'd started a legislative effort for clean air. So, I ran the Clean Air lobbying operation, really.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right, right.
MR. BEEHAN: That was kind of interesting. I'll tell you -- you may know this, you may not know this -- I became friends with a local politician there, and that's kind of how I got my start. His name's Jerry Springer.
MR. MCDANIEL: Jerry Springer.
MR. BEEHAN: Did you know that? (laughs)
MR. MCDANIEL: No, I didn't know that, but I figured when, you know ...
MR. BEEHAN: So, anyway ... So then, I ran, I went to the Lung Association. Then I was, then I went to Little Miami, Incorporated, which is a river preservation non-profit, similar to the Nature Conservancy. There, we got the river, first scenic river in an urban area. But the, I think the most important, one of the most exciting things I did there, was to get, purchase a railroad right-of-way that went 50 miles along the river, and now it's a hiking and biking trail. We did that to protect the scenic river, and now, it's really revitalized that whole corridor up through there.
MR. MCDANIEL: So, you were, you were kind of an activist. I mean, kind of, you know, you ...
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah, I was.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... could put it that way.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: You were kind of a community organizer, weren't you?
MR. BEEHAN: Exactly, I was. That was exactly what I was.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, sure.
MR. BEEHAN: But then, well, I was married and divorced, and then, I think, you probably know my wife, Kay Brookshire. 
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, yes.
MR. BEEHAN: Kay and I were married in… In fact, April Fool's Day is our, two days from now, is our anniversary.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, ok.
MR. BEEHAN: And she, she was a reporter for the Cincinnati Post, and I was doing this non-profit. What ended up happening is that, her dad needed help at State Farm and I'm really transitioned from non-profits. I was an activist, but you don't make a lot of money. (laughs)
MR. MCDANIEL: Well, that's true. You don't. That's just the nature.
MR. BEEHAN: Now, I was, let me tell you, I don't know if I ... You may know this. I don't know if you know this or not, I spent seven years on the Oak Ridge, on the Covington City Commission.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right.
MR. BEEHAN: So, I started as a non-profit guy there, ended up at State Farm, and I ended up being mayor there for three years.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, yes, yes.
MR. BEEHAN: That's when I, some of Jerry's people came over and ran my campaign.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, is that right?
MR. BEEHAN: We used some of the data that, we used computers -- this was 30-something years ago -- that nobody else was using. And anyway, so ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Right. So, so ... you were in this non-profit. You had met your wife.
MR. BEEHAN: We got married.
MR. MCDANIEL: You got married. You were happy in Cincinnati and ...
MR. BEEHAN: Well, we were in Covington.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, Covington, which is right outside Cincinnati.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah, yeah ... We were part of the rehab area, because there's, there was, -- and you'll see this, it's happening in Knoxville. We had a whole neighborhood and we, there had been white flight, for lack of calling it anything else ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure.
MR. BEEHAN: ... to the suburbs, that left this great housing stock. So, we all bought some of the houses, and re-did them and, you know, that was kind of an ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: ... it had neighborhoods. Well, city council would not recognize that. So, basically, we took over city council.
MR. MCDANIEL: Well, let's get into that here in a minute. 
MR. BEEHAN: That's all of it. (laughter)
MR. MCDANIEL: So, you became, so you were about to transition from non-profit to ...
MR. BEEHAN: State Farm.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... State Farm, Ok. Because your, your father-in-law, what were you saying?
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah. Kay's dad, you know, was a doctor in Kingsport, Tennessee. Kay and I are both from Tennessee. He said, you know, this is a great gig, I wish, you know, you ought to talk to somebody about it. So, he set me up with an interview and, it, it sounded pretty good. It was totally different, but not really, because you're helping people with their needs.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure.
MR. BEEHAN: And you become a business person. So, I started, 1982, I became a State Farm agent. Now, the one thing I didn't, we, work, it turned out OK. I had no policies.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, really? Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: I started from scratch. (laughs)
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right, right, exactly.
MR. BEEHAN: But that, and that all worked out, and I did that for five years ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, did you? Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: ... as an agent. In the meantime, our sons were born. Patrick, who is now, he lives in New York City, and Michael who's here. But they grew up in Oak Ridge, because we moved here when they were four and two.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right, right ...
MR. BEEHAN: So they don't know anything ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Other than that, yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: So, State Farm, said to me, “We would like for you to go into management.” I'm thinking, “Well, I'm mayor, I've got things going here, but, if you'll send us back to Tennessee…” They suggested a couple of places, and I said, “Well East Tennessee'll be really nice.” They said, “Well, you can go live in west Knoxville, but you'll have this area.” Kay and I knew the schools here. I just, quite honestly, said, “Well, we think we're going to live in Oak Ridge.”
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right, exactly.
MR. BEEHAN: Because the public schools in Kentucky were really not that good, but here, as you know, and many people live there ...
MR. MCDANIEL: And you had two boys getting ready to start school.
MR. BEEHAN: Four. So anyway, that was the time to move and that's, we moved here, and we lived on the west end for a while, so ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Let me ask you a question, before we get you to Oak Ridge. 
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: You were in, you were in Covington, Kentucky.
MR. BEEHAN: Right.
MR. MCDANIEL: You ran for city council. Why'd you run for city council? Did someone inspire you, or ask you to do that?
MR. BEEHAN: This is ... Not, well, I was ... I was -- back to the activist part, Ok.
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah, yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: I chaired a thing called the Downtown Neighborhood Advisory, and it was a group of neighborhoods. I started my own neighborhood, then we came together with a coalition. One of the things that the city, you know, we need for the core of the city -- it's an urban area.
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: You'd go to meetings, and they weren't very responsive, Ok. So, the group in those neighborhoods, you know, said, well, why don't you run? Then, I had some friends, I'd met some of Springer's folks, and they were ... One of them had moved to Covington, and he said, “We can do this.”
MR. MCDANIEL: Is that right? Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: He said ... So, I mean, that's basically the short version. I still see him. He's ... 
MR. MCDANIEL: Is that right?
MR. BEEHAN: He played tackle at Ohio State. Anyway, but and there ... So, I think at that point, it's back to the days when you're really young, and you're ambitious, and you think you can ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Do anything.
MR. BEEHAN: Right, so you do. (laughs)
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, so you do. You don't know any better.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: So ...
MR. BEEHAN: So that ... And it's nice to have a wife who's a newspaper reporter. Now, she didn't cover, she was in Cincinnati ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right, so she didn't ...
MR. BEEHAN: ... but the Kentucky newspaper people were really very good to me. 
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: And my stuff, oh, my campaign stuff looked good, so ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure. So, you did that, and you were there for how many years? Six?
MR. BEEHAN: I was, I was on, it's city commission. I was city commissioner for four years.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: Then I was mayor for three, and I resigned as mayor to come to Oak Ridge.
MR. MCDANIEL: To come ... Now were you elected mayor or was it like in ... ?
MR. BEEHAN: I was elected mayor.
MR. MCDANIEL: By the populace?
MR. BEEHAN: By the populace.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right, right.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah, and it's a city-manager form of government there.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, I see.
MR. BEEHAN: So, I, and I'll talk about that if you want, but I'm very strong supporter of city-manager government.
MR. MCDANIEL: We'll talk about.
MR. BEEHAN: We'll talk about that, because it transitions over here, too.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, sure.
MR. BEEHAN: But I was directly elected, so, it's it was interesting.
MR. MCDANIEL: So, you, so in what year did you move to Oak Ridge.
MR. BEEHAN: 1987.
MR. MCDANIEL: So, you came to Oak Ridge in 1987 and where was your, where was your office, your, I mean, your State Farm office?
MR. BEEHAN: Well, I didn't have a storefront, remember.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, ok. 
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah, because I was, at that point ... 
MR. MCDANIEL: That's right, you were in management.
MR. BEEHAN: ... I was in management then. So, I was at Tennessee and Kentucky, I can't think of the name of the building, but it's close to where my real estate office is now.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right, right ... 
MR. BEEHAN: And I just rented an office ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: ... because I had nine counties.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, I see.
MR. BEEHAN: So, what I would do is during, I mean, I'd be gone. I had the agents here in Oak Ridge, but I'd be gone the rest. I went all the way down to Jamestown and areas like that, so ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Ok, sure, sure. So, so you moved to Oak Ridge. Kay was, was ... Was Kay happy to move to Oak Ridge, to leave Cincinnati?
MR. BEEHAN: Kay cried all the way down the highway ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Did she really?
MR. BEEHAN: ... because we really had deep roots in there because of ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: ... everything that we had been involved with.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, sure, sure.
MR. BEEHAN: But we're both Tennesseans ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: ... so this was not, we're not coming to a strange place.
MR. MCDANIEL: And you're, kind of, about halfway between ...
MR. BEEHAN: Nashville and Kingsport.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... Nashville and Kingsport.
MR. BEEHAN: And, at the time, one of my dear friends, Father Bill Gahagan, was pastor of St. Mary's. Then, there were some other people we knew here, so it was not going, it was ... But it's a kind of a blow. You're the big, you know, the big fish in a little pond, and you come down here, you're not even in the pond.
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah, you have to start over, don't you?
MR. BEEHAN: But it was, it was definitely worth it.
MR. MCDANIEL: How big is Covington? I mean, as far as population.
MR. BEEHAN: It was 50,000, but if you, if you look at it, it's like the metropolis ... We lived four blocks from the river. We could walk to watch the Reds or the Bengals.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, ok.
MR. BEEHAN: So, there's probably 300,000. It's a wholly different ... In that one county, Kenton County, there are 22 cities.
MR. MCDANIEL: Is that right?
MR. BEEHAN: You can't tell when you're, when you leave one and go to another.
MR. MCDANIEL: I bet.
MR. BEEHAN: Here you can. 
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah, you know ...
MR. BEEHAN: You leave Oak Ridge, you to go to Clinton, leave Oak Ridge, go to Oliver Springs. But that didn't happen there.
MR. MCDANIEL: And up there, it's just like one continuous ...
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... metropolitan area ...
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... that you don't know what city you're in 'til you get stopped by a cop, I guess.
MR. BEEHAN: Then, you look and see. That was a real ... I had a good run there. I went to Tokyo with the governor, when they got the Georgetown plant for Toyota.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, really? Yeah, yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: So, that, I mean, that, it was pretty heady stuff.
MR. MCDANIEL: I bet, I bet. But, as you said, you came to Tennessee and, kind of, nobody really knew you, and you kind of had to start again, didn't you?
MR. BEEHAN: Which was fine ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure.
MR. BEEHAN: ... because you've got a young family and, quite honestly, you know, you really, that's important time for them. So it probably worked out it was the best for the family, that I get away from that. And Kay, up there, was a reporter for the Cincinnati Post, so between the two of us, it was crazy. I mean, she had a beat. She covered federal court.
MR. MCDANIEL: Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: So she goes into the Sixth District Court of Appeals to pull all the, and she comes home and says, "What is this lawsuit that the state of Tennessee has against DOE about radiation in Oak Ridge?"
MR. MCDANIEL: Is that right? Yeah, sure.
MR. BEEHAN: I don't know. But I, we, it was the, it was a retrieval, I can't remember what it was, but anyway, we're, we got over all that. But that was the first time, I, you know, you realize that not everybody appreciates what goes on in Oak Ridge, and that that kind of a headline can stop you in your tracks.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, sure, absolutely.
MR. BEEHAN: But we already made the commitment, so we were ...
MR. MCDANIEL: But she was, when Oak Ridge popped up, she was like, uh-oh, what's going on here.
MR. BEEHAN: Well, look at the lawsuit, too.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, sure, exactly. The ... Just a side note there, that federal court in Cincinnati is where the appeals was for the Clinton, the Clinton lawsuit against Anderson County, for the Clinton 12.
MR. BEEHAN: Really?
MR. MCDANIEL: It went, it was ...
MR. BEEHAN: I should have known that.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... appealed to federal court in Cincinnati, and that's where it sat while they waited for the Supreme Court to decide Brown vs. the Board of Education.
MR. BEEHAN: I'll be.
MR. MCDANIEL: Then, once the Supreme Court passed Brown, they sent it back to Judge Taylor in Knoxville ...
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... to make the decision. 
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: So ...
MR. BEEHAN: Well, she used to cover that, I mean, that ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Well, that was long before she was born.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah, yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: So ... (laughs)
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah, and newspapers have changed and all that, but in the day, she had a specific beat, you know.
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: You don't see that anymore.
MR. MCDANIEL: No, you don't, you really don't, you don't. Ok, so you, so you come to Oak Ridge. Tell me about life in Oak Ridge starting, starting life in Oak Ridge, for you, and for Kay and ...
MR. BEEHAN: And the boys.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... and the boys.
MR. BEEHAN: Well, life in Oak Ridge was totally different than ... We'd lived in an urban area, ok.
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: It wasn't unusual to hear gunshot sometimes. I rode with the, I had this habit of riding with the police, I need to tell you that, because I did with my dad, I did in Oak Ridge, and I did in Covington. So I, I knew, probably if you knew what's going on, you probably would not be happy anywhere you were.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: So, we moved from the urban area, it's old homes. Our house was 150 years old. So, I call a realtor here, Pat Zenoli, some people will know Pat, and said, we've got this great old home -- and I should know this, I grew up in Nashville and that there are no old homes over, at that time, 50 years old here.
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah, exactly.
MR. BEEHAN: So we'd like a nice old home to match, to be equal to the one we left. Well, there's no such thing.
MR. MCDANIEL: Exactly.
MR. BEEHAN: So we ended up in the west end, on Newport Drive, and it was a great house. But it, the mixture was a lot different here. We had, we were in the suburbs, and I hadn't been in the suburbs in a long time, and it was, it was great. First of all, we had the schools. When you come to Oak Ridge, it ...  Not everybody's been here for 150 years, and so, it doesn't take long, if you want to get involved, and this is my ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Pitch.
MR. BEEHAN: ... elevator speech ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Right..
MR. BEEHAN: ... if you will ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure.
MR. BEEHAN: ... for Oak Ridge. 
MR. MCDANIEL: Exactly.
MR. BEEHAN: You can ... You can be involved very easily, and that was the one thing we found. They went to Linden School, which, I think, you're familiar with.
MR. MCDANIEL: Yes.
MR. BEEHAN: It was, it was just a great experience. They got a great education. We did Indian Guides, we did, we did things that we could've never done. We'd have done something different.
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: I'm sure we would've done it.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure.
MR. BEEHAN: The opportunities here for our family and for them to grow and to come, become the men they are today, it's, it was pretty, looking back on it, it was pretty cool.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right.
MR. BEEHAN: They went to, I mean, and Kay got involved, as a member at the Y. YW was very, very active ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right.
MR. BEEHAN: ... back then. It will be again some day.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure.
MR. BEEHAN: She loved doing the English as a Second Language. She still does a lot of that kind of thing. Just with the, the internationals, so it was a great, it was a great move for us. Once we, I mean, and, but you come to a new town, and the one thing I've found, you don't have the kind of friends you had, you know.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: But what happens is, your kids, you get involved with your kids, and all of a sudden, there's adults there.
MR. MCDANIEL: That are in the same situation you are in.
MR. BEEHAN: So, it doesn't take, and I think in this community, it doesn't take very long to build relationships that, again, they last a lifetime. I think that's what this town has. I'm a little biased about Oak Ridge. This is the longest I've ever lived any place.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, is that right? Ok. But, so, you came here, the kids, you both got involved in the community. The, you were working hard, and all, but, and the kids were starting to grow up and take advantage of all the opportunities, like you said ...
MR. BEEHAN: Oh, yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... in the school system, and the community, that they offer kids, that ...
MR. BEEHAN: It's unbelievable.
MR. MCDANIEL: It's unbelievable. The ... And, as you said, it was, you know, you, kind of, went from an urban environment, to more of a rural, not really rural, but suburban.
MR. BEEHAN: Suburban, really, yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: Suburban environment, it was, life was probably a little slower paced here, maybe, than there.
MR. BEEHAN: It was then, it's not now for us. (laughs)
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right.
MR. BEEHAN: It was a lot slower paced.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, sure
MR. BEEHAN: But it was a different pace, too.
MR. MCDANIEL: Exactly.
MR. BEEHAN: I mean, it was centered around our family, and our children. I think that that's, I don't know that we would have been able to, we, the same quality would not have happened in Covington, Kentucky, that happened here.
MR. MCDANIEL: Did you know, I mean, did you know very much about Oak Ridge when you came here?
MR. BEEHAN: Well, I knew about the schools. I grew up in Nashville.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right.
MR. BEEHAN: So, I knew about the schools, I knew about, that the bomb ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: ...was made here. I knew there were some pretty darned smart people here. I knew they had pretty good sports programs.
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: So, and I, and I knew Bill Gahagan. And the other thing, I guess, I need to say, I was a camp counselor at Camp Marymount, as a Catholic seminarian in Nashville. There was a whole group of people who came from Oak Ridge to Camp Marymount.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, ok.
MR. BEEHAN: The Zenolis, Soldanos. Those names mean anything to you?
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, sure.
MR. BEEHAN: So, I knew, you know, I knew the kind of people who, the kiddos that came, so, anyway.
MR. MCDANIEL: They're pretty impressive.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah, and they still are.
MR. MCDANIEL: Still are pretty impressive. Ok, so, so, here you are, you're in Oak Ridge. You're, you, kind of, you know, put down some roots, and they're starting to grow, and you decide to get involved in politics again.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah. Well, I started working on campaigns ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, did you? Ok. 
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah, Kay and ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Tell me about that.
MR. BEEHAN: Well, Kay and I worked on ... in fact, I ran Gene Caldwell's campaign for state rep.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, did you?
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah, and you don't, you know, you don't say that out loud, you just get behind the scenes ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure.
MR. BEEHAN: ... and work on it. I like doing that. I worked on Walt Brown's campaign. I worked on Tim, Tim Stallings campaign. Do you know Tim?
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah, I know Tim.
MR. BEEHAN: Tim, do you remember that he won by one vote? Do you remember that?
MR. MCDANIEL: No, I don't remember that, but I know Tim.
MR. BEEHAN: What happened there was, that Walt Brown lost, but Walt and Linda had voted for Tim, and Tim did not vote for him. He'll tell you that story.
MR. MCDANIEL: Is that right?
MR. BEEHAN: So I worked on, I ran Tim's campaign. So, I liked, I liked doing that. So, once you do that, people realize that, you know, that you have some, maybe, you have a bent towards that.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, sure.
MR. BEEHAN: So I think that that's when I started. Well, we did a lot of stuff in the community with the boys, but then, the politics and the community, I was, and then it ... Ok, so I did that piece. I was chairman of the Oak Ridge Chamber, at one point.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, is that right? 
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah. 
MR. MCDANIEL: Ok, all right.
MR. BEEHAN: It's kind of ironic, it was the year Mercedes tried to come. I don't know if you remember that or not. And the year that Tech 2020 started, which is now being sold.
MR. MCDANIEL: It's being sold, it is, isn't it?
MR. BEEHAN: So the, so I was involved in the Chamber, some politics, you know, business stuff. 
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right.
MR. BEEHAN: I'm rattling ... I should let you ask some more questions ... 
MR. MCDANIEL: No, no, no, no, no, no... Just rattle on! So, you were involved in the community, you got involved ...
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah, this is ...
MR. MCDANIEL: ... business community, and ...
MR. BEEHAN: And the political.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... and the political. And then, you decided, well, you know, maybe, maybe ...
MR. BEEHAN: I tell you what, what bothered, I was starting to see, and I guess, I saw this from the insurance side, but also, I started to see in Oak Ridge, something that was similar to Covington's inner city, and that is the deterioration of a certain housing stock.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right.
MR. BEEHAN: It wasn't necessarily the higher, you know, the real nice structures that you saw in some older cities.
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: It was these $6,000 ...
MR. MCDANIEL: These World War, World War II homes.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah. 
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: Then, you start to see some things happening. Hear stories about at school, some of the kids are having trouble, and the police, and you starting to see that this is, to me it was out of sight, out of mind, but it looked a little bit like an inner city ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: ... refurbishing. I started with, you remember Steve Murray, the Housing Development Corporation? We put together a housing task force to start to see what we could really do to make a change. You don't, there were some, and they're still out there, accept it's now focused more, some, some people owning property that weren't taking care of it, and renting to whoever ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, exactly.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah. So, that's I guess that's when I got back into saying, which is the same, it's kind of deja vu all over again because that's what I did in Kentucky.
MR. MCDANIEL: That's what you did in Kentucky. But you saw, you saw that there were some changes that were happening in the community, that would, would, that, if, if weren't addressed, would be, have a certainly det, negative impact ...
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... on the future of the community.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah, and ok, and full disclosure: I love politics, Ok. Love them. So you put those together, and that's what I ran on in the first ... I used everything I knew. It wasn't my first rodeo.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: I'd run, like, five times before I came here, So I, we knew how to run a campaign.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, sure.
MR. BEEHAN: So, the first time I ran, I was elected, and that was 2001.
MR. MCDANIEL: 2001, who was the mayor?
MR. BEEHAN: The mayor at the time was, at the time -- he didn't stay the mayor -- was Jerry Kuhaida, and then ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Didn't he resign and, like, move away, or something?
MR. BEEHAN: No, he did but he was still on the council, but we elect ... Every, every two years, they elect the city, in Oak Ridge, you elect the mayor.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right, exactly.
MR. BEEHAN: And David Bradshaw was elected mayor in 2000 and I was elected mayor pro tem.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right.
MR. BEEHAN: So, and then, you know.
MR. MCDANIEL: So how long were you on the city council?
MR. BEEHAN: Thirteen years.
MR. MCDANIEL: Thirteen years in Oak Ridge. Wow. 
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah, it was ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Talk about some of your biggest challenges, and your biggest moments and, you know, some of your biggest successes, biggest failures. 
MR. BEEHAN: Woof... (laughs)
MR. MCDANIEL: I mean, you know, I know you don't like to talk about things that didn't go well, but ...
MR. BEEHAN: Well, no, I, heck, in an oral history, it doesn't matter.
MR. MCDANIEL: It happens, it happens, that's exactly right.
MR. BEEHAN: It does happen, it does happen. Yeah, some of the biggest ... Of course, it's still ongoing. We started working in 2001, trying to figure out what to do with the mall.
MR. MCDANIEL: With the mall.
MR. BEEHAN: Do you remember that?
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, absolutely.
MR. BEEHAN: That, hopefully, that will be ... But that, there was two referendums on what to do about retail. Retail has been a real, has not come back the way it should. I think it will. I think the Kroger's project is proving to the outside world that there is a market here. And I think that's going to change. But that was, that was really frustrating. We had two votes where the community, you know, rightfully or wrongfully, turned down retail. And that was ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure.
MR. BEEHAN: That was very discouraging.
MR. MCDANIEL: But that was probably before, that was probably before a lot of this TIF stuff, wasn't it? Or was that, was not addressed?
MR. BEEHAN: That was not addressed ... 
MR. MCDANIEL: Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: ... and we should have.
MR. MCDANIEL: Ok, right.
MR. BEEHAN: They wanted to do a bond, the bond was, could be put on the ballot, both developers did ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: ... We should have talked them out of it, and didn't.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, sure, exactly, exactly.
MR. BEEHAN: So, we got what we got. So ... 
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: Then, and that was, and I'm still, it's, I want instant success, and the housing thing is just going to take a while.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right, right.
MR. BEEHAN: We still have issues that we now focused on. All of the CDBG [Community Development Block Grant] money, which is the federal money that used to get, kind of get scattered, is now focused strictly on the old neighborhoods. So I'm really pleased with that, especially the Land Bank. I think that's a very viable ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Right. Now, what does the Land Bank do. And didn't you start that, or you were part of starting that?
MR. BEEHAN: I was part in that, yeah. I was on the council. Charlie Jernigan gets credit for that, but we were the pilot.
MR. MCDANIEL: Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: And it's, it's a non-profit run by the city ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: ... that can, and there were certain amount of money set aside where they could go, they would target at properties.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: The theory was to, if you get a bad piece of property, got two on either side, buy it, and take it down, and either in-fill it with a new house, or let it go to the adjoining properties.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: What happens, you start to raise the values of all the housing in a particular neighborhood. That is underway now. It's not going to be a fast fix.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right. 
MR. BEEHAN: I mean, it really, really isn't.
MR. MCDANIEL: It's kind of like surgically pruning ...
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL:  ... you know.
MR. BEEHAN: It's just, I want fast, but it's starting to work. 
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: The other thing that. That ... the housing thing ... Oh, I'm really happy ... I'm known to like the police wherever I go, Ok.
MR. MCDANIEL: Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: I'm really happy to see the concentration, that we don't, that they're using the data where crimes are, versus ... They don't just randomly patrol.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right.
MR. BEEHAN: They use the data, and they have a, and I'm really pleased with that. I know that the chief is, has been, he gets ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: ... knocked around a little bit, but I think what has happened in the Police Department. I think people want safe neighborhoods, and I think they feel a whole lot safer today than they did five or 10 years ago, because of some of the things that are going on.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, exactly, exactly. I mean, and not to disparage anyone, but it's, it's, you know, it's one thing to be said, that can be said for not having, you know, and I don't want to call it a "good ol' boy" Police Department, but a lot of these small East Tennessee towns, that's what they have is, they have people who've been there a long time, that know everybody. Then, sometimes, when you have new officers come in from, that moved to the area from outside, they don't have any personal connections and things such as that, and sometimes, that's more effective.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah. So I'm real pleased with that. I really ... The other thing, you know, just to reflect a little bit on ... I'm really pleased that we've hired professional city managers and ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah, talk ... you were mentioning that earlier.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah, I really feel pretty strongly about this, you know. I was directly elected mayor. I was elected by a council here, and I considered myself to be a figurehead, a meeter, a greeter.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: But I had no training in, in police matters, fire matters, human resources, you know, that kind of thing. We've had people who run the city on a ... They're the CEOs [Chairman, Executive Officer].
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: They, they do have that training. Now, they're humans, they've got faults, but, I think, we've been able to hire some pretty qualified people through the years, and I'm really happy. I support that. My dad was, was ... When the police department in Nashville would always get political ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: ... you know, and you can get political if you have a mayor. You get a mayor and you may get one who knows what they're doing, or you may get one like in Toronto recently, who was smoking crack cocaine, you know.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, sure, exactly.
MR. BEEHAN: So I'd rather have the council, you know, hire a ... a city manager, CEO.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, sure, sure. But council and the mayor, I mean, they're respon ... they're elected by the people, and they were responsible to the people for the management ...
MR. BEEHAN: Right.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... of the town.
MR. BEEHAN: Absolutely.
MR. MCDANIEL: So, but in your, in your ... To act responsibly, you need a professional.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah, somebody who knows how to ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah, it's just, it's kind of like the school board.
MR. BEEHAN: Exactly.
MR. MCDANIEL: You hire a professional school administrator ...
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... to run the school system, you know. So ...
MR. BEEHAN: I don't want to see the school superintendent elected.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right.
MR. BEEHAN: I, it's, you know, I want somebody who has a PhD in educational administration, blah, blah, you know.
MR. MCDANIEL: Well, sure, of course. It's kind of like you don't want your doctor elected.
MR. BEEHAN: No, thank you.
MR. MCDANIEL: You don't want your surgeon elected, you know.
MR. BEEHAN: No, I just had my knee done, and I'm glad it was a guy from Harvard that did it.
MR. MCDANIEL: But, really, it's sort of like that, I mean ...
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah, that's a good analogy.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... it really is.
MR. BEEHAN: That's a really good analogy. And ... I don't want to rattle too long but ...
MR. MCDANIEL: That’s ok.
MR. BEEHAN: ... some of the things I really enjoyed, I'll tell you. I was, ended up being the president of the Tennessee Municipal League for a year. I thought that was a real honor, but it was good for Oak Ridge. Tennessee Municipal League is all the elected officials across the state.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: So, therefore I was able to represent them, and the fact that Oak Ridge was on my name tag ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure.
MR. BEEHAN: ... I think, really helped.
MR. MCDANIEL: Absolutely.
MR. BEEHAN: And the, the ... I was chairman of the Energy Community Alliance, which is the group of local governments that comes together and, quite honestly, push very hard and on the national park, and I was able to testify before the Senate and the House, as the head of that, but also the mayor of Oak Ridge saying this is something very, very important.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right. Did you find that you had opportunities to do things because you were the mayor of Oak Ridge, and because of the kind of city it was, that you might not have had at, let's say, Covington, or something like that?
MR. BEEHAN: Oh, never, never would've had it in Covington. 
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right.
MR. BEEHAN: I mean, I was on the board of the Municipal League, but never ... I think being out, being elected official from Oak Ridge gave me a niche. I mean, to be able ... I went to the White House last year with Madeline Rogero, and we, when they were doing the thing on the 3-D printing and ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, sure, yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: I spent, we, so .. I mean, that was really cool to be able to do that. I was one of 22 mayors.
MR. MCDANIEL: Wow.
MR. BEEHAN: And if it hadn't a-been, if he hadn't been mayor of Oak Ridge, he'd have never done it.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, of course.
MR. BEEHAN: And what came out of that, and this, you really, you'd have to know the background, was the trip, once we did that, then the trip the president made to Clinton last year ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN:  ... and he brought, if we brought the money to the area, I forgot how much it was, like $300 Million. Of course, I was gone by then ... 
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: ... but I was, I watched it on TV. 
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, of course.
MR. BEEHAN: But all of that, kind of, came out of that. So, those, those high level things were, were really, you know, very ... That was gratifying. It, hopefully it helped the city, but ultimately, if you're a local official, you come back and you do the day-to-day stuff.
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah, exactly. What were some of the, well, I mean, you know, you mentioned the, you mentioned the housing, you know, you mentioned ...
MR. BEEHAN: Retail.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... the, you know, retail, and the mall. What are some of the other things that's really been a challenge for you.
MR. BEEHAN: Well, it's going on right now and it's really, really the challenge here, I'm sorry ...
MR. MCDANIEL: No, no, you're fine.
MR. BEEHAN: Is for the City of Oak Ridge to deal with DOE.
MR. MCDANIEL: Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: And that is what ...
MR. MCDANIEL: And that's been going on for decades, hasn't it? 
MR. BEEHAN: I know.
MR. MCDANIEL: So tell me about that.
MR. BEEHAN: Well, as ... as many people know, the city is the home of, of DOE, and about 12,000 employees, who have three locations here: K-25, ORNL and Y-12. Therefore, they use city services, and we're the only community that has them in the heart of our city. Yeah, I've been to the other locations, and the DOE facilities are out from town.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, exactly.
MR. BEEHAN: We've got them right here, and we've got a diversity of them. So trying to, to get them rounded up ... (laughs)
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: ... and what we, and you hear it: Pay their fair share of funds to keep the city running.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure.
MR. BEEHAN: It's a struggle. I'm not sure where it's going to end up. And it's been going on for generations.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, yeah, they had the whole, "in lieu of," payments, you know.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: In lieu of taxes, wasn't it?
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah, lieu of taxes, they paid the same rate as architected, agricultural land in 1943.
MR. MCDANIEL: Exactly.
MR. BEEHAN: Well ... 
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: So ... I really appreciate what they do for our country, and for us, and for jobs, and everything, but there is also a, a -- I wouldn't call it a burden -- but there's a cost to the city to do business.
MR. MCDANIEL: Absolutely.
MR. BEEHAN: The other thing that's happened is, it used to be all those folks lived in town, so you'd find them on the United Way whatever, whatever, they're not here, any more, for the most part. So, you've got, it's so strong now, you love them, but, you know, you want ...
MR. MCDANIEL:  And you appreciate, you appreciate what they do, first of all, for our country.
MR. BEEHAN: Absolutely.
MR. MCDANIEL: You appreciate what they do for our, for our community.
MR. BEEHAN: Absolutely.
MR. MCDANIEL: And you love having them here, but you just want to make sure that, that, you know, it's not, it's not a financially bankrupt system for the city, by having them here.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah, so that, that has been ... I was on council for 13 years, and that was always an intention, the whole time. 
MR. MCDANIEL: And a lot of times, you had council members that worked at the plants.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: You know, that was another thing.
MR. BEEHAN: I was the first mayor that had no connection -- did not come through that system.
MR. MCDANIEL: Is that right?
MR. BEEHAN: Now, Warren Gooch, as the current president (mayor), didn't either, but I was the first one.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, exactly.
MR. BEEHAN: Which, I, you know, I just didn't do that. (laughs)
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah, yeah, sure. No, I understand, I understand.
MR. BEEHAN: So that, that was interesting. I got pretty much, I'll give them credit, especially Gerald Boyd, we'd spend time ... He was at the DOE. He's since retired.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: They, they do the best, and they did a pretty decent job on briefing me on what's going on.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right.
MR. BEEHAN: But that's all been split out. They did away with that position, so ... It's, it's ...
MR. MCDANIEL: And a lot of it's, you know, it's Washington, now. You know, you have to go to Washington.
MR. BEEHAN: And I did a lot of that, let me tell you.
MR. MCDANIEL: Did you?
MR. BEEHAN: Which was what, I mean, I think I had a way of doing that. I knew how to do that.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: So ...
MR. MCDANIEL: As, mayor, what was your biggest challenge?
MR. BEEHAN: Well ...
MR. MCDANIEL: I mean, your biggest single challenge?
MR. BEEHAN: The biggest single challenge ... Let's ... I lived in two different generations as an elected official, ok? In Kentucky, in Covington, you had the morning paper, and the afternoon paper.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: And you'd read them and then, there'd be a phone call on an old landline, ok? So, then you'd come to this generation and you've got... Newspapers are going, it's constant...
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: ... emails, constant blogs ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: ... constant Facebook, constant... And the biggest challenge is the overload of that, and then, trying to communicate with your constituents. I really was strong, and I really believed, I think there was a move at one point for the cable companies to do away with televising the city council meetings. It's hard to abbreviate it or do it. I mean, I think that is really important, but the communications stuff now is so complicated.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: And ...
MR. MCDANIEL: And, because it's because it's constant. I mean, it's constant.
MR. BEEHAN: It is constant.
MR. MCDANIEL: And with that is a much greater risk of things not being accurate.
MR. BEEHAN: No kidding! (laughs) How do you like it when somebody calls you up and says, "I read it on the internet and it's gospel."
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah, yeah ...
MR. BEEHAN: And you go, "Oh?" 
MR. MCDANIEL: ... exactly, exactly.
MR. BEEHAN: Here's one of my things about that, you know, I would use, and I use email, and I did use email a lot. I'm pretty, I think I'm pretty tech savvy. But what I would do more often -- I still do it -- there's nothing takes the place of a face to face or a phone call. When you try to do -- and it drives me crazy -- try to do public policy on email, without a, I mean, it's, it's, people read tone into it ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Absolutely.
MR. BEEHAN: ... that you never intended and they're mad at you. I mean, it's just... The biggest challenge today is all of that, you know, keeping that balanced.
MR. MCDANIEL: And you have to use it, because, I mean, it's just part ...
MR. BEEHAN: Right, absolutely.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... part of the life.
MR. BEEHAN: But I would not, I was very ... It's not that I didn't want to communicate, but I'm, I did use email.
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: I mean ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: But, if there's something I wanted to, policy, I'd pick up the phone and call you, Keith.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, sure, exactly. You know, and one of the other things about, that I'm sure that is a challenge, especially now, is, you know, when we were growing up, you had journalists, you had ...
MR. BEEHAN: I married one.
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah, you married ... You had real journalists who did their homework ...
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... who wrote, who tried to do, as best as they could, an unbiased presentation of the facts. Now, people read things on the internet, and it's agenda pieces, it's people's personal opinions, and it's becoming harder and harder for folks to differentiate ...
MR. BEEHAN: Oh, yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... between journalism and opinions.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: You know.
MR. BEEHAN: It's pretty, it's pretty amazing. 
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: It really, really is.
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: That's the challenge. It's a challenge to, and so, you watch what's going on now, and this'll be watched, maybe, you know, later on, but we're in the middle of a presidential campaign that's just nuts. You'd never believe that any of that, things could be, people calling wives out.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, sure.
MR. BEEHAN: I mean, you go, Oh!
MR. MCDANIEL: Well, he started it, you know. 
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah, I mean, as somebody said today, you know, that's like a fifth grader. It's the answer you get ... 
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah, that's exactly ...
MR. BEEHAN: ... "Well, he started it." Anyway.
MR. MCDANIEL: Let me ...
MR. BEEHAN: Because that ... That, I mean, that's the biggest challenge, I think, is all of the communications stuff. 
MR. MCDANIEL: Speaking, speaking of that, that's a good point, let me ask you this, and I've asked other politicians, or political, you know, politically, I mean ...
MR. BEEHAN: I'm ok with that.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... public officials. 
MR. BEEHAN: I'm ok. I know I'm ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Public officials.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah, because I really am both, I'm not ...
MR. MCDANIEL: There's a, there's a, to me, there's a difference between a public official and a politician. What, to what degree does party come into a small town ...
MR. BEEHAN: Zero.
MR. MCDANIEL: Zero ...
MR. BEEHAN: That I found, anyway.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... party affiliation.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: I think that's the best thing that happens. It, it was the same thing in Covington, and it's the same thing here. Let's elect the best people that we got. And we had a mixture on every, on every council I've been on. I knew what they were.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, sure.
MR. BEEHAN: But the streets and the, and the pick up the garbage, and the police, and fire, they're not ...
MR. MCDANIEL: They don't care whether you're ...
MR. BEEHAN: ... Democrat or Republican.
MR. MCDANIEL: That's right.
MR. BEEHAN: And, and I'm thank ... and when I was in Cincinnati, or we were up there, the Cincinnati City Council had three parties, so, if you were going to, so they would, they, we got way ahead of them on the riverfront, because they couldn't. The parties were dictating the votes, where we didn't have to worry about that. You do what you think's best for the community, and that happens here, too.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure.
MR. BEEHAN: There's a real mixture on this council right now. There was a mixture on every council I was on. When we came to presidential stuff, we would vary, but when it came to the city, that, thank goodness (laughs) ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right, right ...
MR. BEEHAN: ... thank goodness that was not a factor that I ever saw. It was, David, David Bradshaw -- we can talk -- David Bradshaw was a Republican. I'm a Democrat and we were in lock step.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, exactly.
MR. BEEHAN: There's no reason not to be. I feel very strongly about that, and the city manager. The local government, I had more, I can't, I was in local government for 20 years. I can't imagine a place where you could have more impact than here, or in council, or in city council, local government. You can have -- it's tough, I mean, to get out there, and people get mad, but you can make an impact, and it's very rewarding. I don't know how Nashville would be rewarding. Maybe it is. It is for some people. 
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure.
MR. BEEHAN: It wouldn't be for me.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure. The ... And that, I guess, that's part of, part of being a, an elected official, is having to toughen up your skin a little bit.
MR. BEEHAN: Oh, yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: What was, was that natural for you or did you have a hard time with that?
MR. BEEHAN: I got used to it. (laughs)
MR. MCDANIEL: Did you? Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: (laughs) I got used to it. Yeah. Well, first of all, you all have, you have an ego.
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: And that ...
MR. MCDANIEL: And to be any kind of leader, generally, you have to have ...
MR. BEEHAN: You got to have that.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... a strong personality.
MR. BEEHAN: You have that, but you need to be aware of that, too ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: ... because that can, we've seen the good side of that, and the bad side ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: ... on people. But that, that gets the time ... There was two times that people -- and I won't tell you the things against my kids, trying to call out my kids.
MR. MCDANIEL: Really?
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah. And ...
MR. MCDANIEL: I guess that wouldn't go over well, would it?
MR. BEEHAN: Well that, I wasn't tough on that one, I was ... That, one of of them was in Covington, and I had the FBI on that one. Here, it was just, it wasn't anything.
MR. MCDANIEL: It was a, pardon my ...
MR. BEEHAN: It was a known, a known ... yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... French, it was a dumbass.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah, yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: I knew who that was. But the one in Covington was really kind of crazy. But anyway, yeah, I mean, you make, I used to say, in the, to you or anybody else, in the course of the next however many years I'm on whatever board I'm on, I'm going to make some decisions, and you're not going to like it. I'm not doing it on purpose, I'm doing what I think is best. But please, you know, understand it's not personal.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure.
MR. BEEHAN: I'm trying to do what I think's best. 
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: I say, I say that even during the campaigns, you know.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: I'm going, you may be, I'm going to do something to make everybody mad. And I probably did. I'm sure I did. I think Kay was mad at me a couple of times.
MR. MCDANIEL: Well, I mean, but you, but you ... You were doing what you thought was best for the community, didn't you?
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah so, and, yeah, that is hard because the expectations of people, sometimes, are not really very realistic, you know, sometimes. And they'll let you know, there's some mean, people are just, we have all kinds of personalities.
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah, sure.
MR. BEEHAN: I've talked about this before, since I'm not there any more ...
MR. MCDANIEL: That’s ok.
MR. BEEHAN: The CAVE people.
MR. MCDANIEL: Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: It's the Committee Against Virtually Everything. (laughter) They're in every town.
MR. MCDANIEL: They're in every town.
MR. BEEHAN: And it doesn't matter, they're just, they woke up this morning, and they're ...
MR. MCDANIEL: And they're against something.
MR. BEEHAN: ... they're Debbie Downers, and you're going to hear from them. So, you kind of steel yourself against it. You can't let them get in your head.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: You can't, you know, and that's, some people do it better than others, but ...
MR. MCDANIEL: And some people do it just, their heart's in the right place ...
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... they just, that's just the way they are.
MR. BEEHAN: That's their personalities.
MR. MCDANIEL: That's their personalities.
MR. BEEHAN: That's who they are. And you ...
MR. MCDANIEL: And then, there's some, they're ... Ok, without saying names, there was probably somebody on your city council that was like that, but I think their heart was in the right place.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: Whereas, there may be somebody on city council today that's just plain mean.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah. 
MR. MCDANIEL: There's a difference.
MR. BEEHAN: There's a huge difference. A huge difference. (laughter) And we're seeing more of that other kind these days.
MR. MCDANIEL: I know, which is sad.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah. That bothers me, you know, I want to make sure ... I was talking to somebody the other day, he's a good friend. He's of a different party than I am, but we were talking about this issue on local government. He said, “You know, back in the day, in fact, not too long ago, the local government was a civic duty. It was not a political position, necessarily, you know, in the sense of ... And what, you got people to do it because you needed them to do it, they had some skills and they went and did it. We need to make sure that, hopefully, we got people like that sitting in those seats.”
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right
MR. BEEHAN: That this is a public service.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure. And that, that's part of the responsibility of living in this town.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: You know, it really is. So, just like serving on one of the many dozens of boards that you have here. (laughter)
MR. BEEHAN: I love doing that. That's my, that's my latest thing. I get more enjoy ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Well, that's what, that's what I was about to ask. What, since you went off city council, what've you been doing?
MR. BEEHAN: Well, let's see, I'm, this I really love -- I may have told you this -- but, I'm the president of the board of the Children's Museum.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, no, I didn't know that.
MR. BEEHAN: And, we have just hired a new director and we've got new ... and I am so excited about that, because I think that has such an impact on this town, and the, and the children here, plus the region. And it's such, Selma Shapiro, God love her, God rest her soul, did a wonderful job, and we need to take it to the next level.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure.
MR. BEEHAN: So, I'm loving that.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure.
MR. BEEHAN: I'm having a ball.
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: Then, I'm in the Rotary Club, and am on ADFAC and I play in a bluegrass band. You know that, don't you?
MR. MCDANIEL: That ... You play in a bluegrass band.
MR. BEEHAN: (laughs) With the teachers from ...
MR. MCDANIEL: With the teachers ... I know, I know the fiddle player.
MR. BEEHAN: Abby.
MR. MCDANIEL: I know she teaches, you know ...
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... she teaches violin and strings, so ...
MR. BEEHAN: That band came together, another Oak Ridge story.
MR. MCDANIEL: Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: The sister city program goes to Japan. Kay and I and Abby Horner, who your reference is ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: ... to Japan. They're coming over here for the 20th anniversary, and we looked around and, who? Ok, there's other teachers who have gone. Steve Reddick plays guitar, Scott Lynn plays mandolin, Gary, Gary Coleman's son's getting ready to go.
MR. MCDANIEL: So, are they all teachers?
MR. BEEHAN: No, all of them, but Gary is not.
MR. MCDANIEL: Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: But his son. So, we got four teachers ...
MR. MCDANIEL: And then you ... ?
MR. BEEHAN: ... and then Gary and I. 
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: (laughs) So, the other thing, because of that, it's a wide range ... we're not all the same ... I'm the oldest, and I don't know how old, Abby is. She may break 30 any day now.
MR. MCDANIEL: That's what I was about to say, she's probably in her late 20s, you know.
MR. BEEHAN: So it's a mixture, and we have a good time. I enjoy doing that. The Children's' Museum I really think is a lot, I really like that a lot.
MR. MCDANIEL: Now, are you still working? Are you retired?
MR. BEEHAN: Oh, yeah, no, (laughs) I'm still working, too.
MR. MCDANIEL: Ok, all right.
MR. BEEHAN: I'm still doing real work... I got, which I can't tell ... I've got a .. 
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right.
MR. BEEHAN: I am really working hard. I like doing that. It's like putting the deal together, and I ...
MR. MCDANIEL: So, you're a real estate ...
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: You do real estate now? Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: Getting ready. I've got a couple of, in the next six weeks you'll see some of, it's retail stuff that I'm doing right now.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, is that right? Ok.
MR. BEEHAN: So, I'm really ... And that's fun, because it's a business deal, but I'm going to bring some things to town, and change things. I'm just ... 
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, sure.
MR. BEEHAN: So, I'm real excited about that.
MR. MCDANIEL: Your, your ... and those take a long time, but they probably are a lot more satisfying.
MR. BEEHAN: Oh, very satisfying. 
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: You'll see. I mean, you will see, and of course...
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, of course.
MR. BEEHAN: ... other people ...
MR. MCDANIEL: By the time anybody reads this ... We don't want to say what it is because ...
MR. BEEHAN: It'll be history.
MR. MCDANIEL: ... you don't want to jinx it, you know.
MR. BEEHAN: No, no, no, no, no ... We, no, I think we ...
MR. MCDANIEL: It might all fall apart.
MR. BEEHAN: ... we're pretty close, but, yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: Yeah, yeah.
MR. BEEHAN: I've done some other. I mean, I did the Holiday Inn Express. I did those two assisted living centers here.
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, did you? Oh, ok.
MR. BEEHAN: Which, I really like them but I've done, you know, so, I've had a pretty good run.
MR. MCDANIEL: Well good, good. What, what do you ... We've got a couple of minutes or so left.
MR. BEEHAN: We did this a long time.
MR. MCDANIEL: This, we've been 53 minutes, so, we ... What, what do you think are the big challenges as a former mayor, former city council, what do you think are the big challenges for Oak Ridge right now?
MR. BEEHAN: Well, I think, right now, and when you're, you'll be watching this, I hope it'll be over and done with. Is be the retailing and taking that mass that the mall was, and redoing it into a contemporary, a town center where people drive in, you have the mixed use, you have people living there, and I think that will make a huge difference as far as the community. So, that's a challenge right now.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right.
MR. BEEHAN: The other one is, trying to figure out how to maximize the presence of the DOE facilities in this town, to the benefit of the community, and that, those two, that's, that's a big one. That's a long-term one.
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, sure. You know, and it's hard to do when you have everybody that works there, living outside of Oak Ridge.
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah, yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: Or, you know, 80 percent. I don't know what percentage it is, but I bet it's probably 80 percent.
MR. BEEHAN: It is 80 percent, 80 to 90 percent. And it used to be 90 ...
MR. MCDANIEL: And it used to be the opposite. It used to be 90 percent of them worked here and lived here.
MR. BEEHAN: So, so, we ... we pushed ahead the Pellissippi four-lane. (laughs)
MR. MCDANIEL: Oh, yeah, right. Should have never done that. So ... But anyway ...
MR. BEEHAN: But, but I think those are the biggest, and the third one would be housing.
MR. MCDANIEL: Housing, right.
MR. BEEHAN: I said, and I said this when I was mayor, and I'll say it ... I think three big things that people look for in a community are, are safe neighborhoods. And you, they can describe safe neighborhoods to themselves. It could be having good neighbors. It could be having police, but feeling safe is really important.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: Good educational facilities and I think we've got that with the schools and Roane State ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure.
MR. BEEHAN: ... and, of course, UT close by. But economic development and that economic development. Those are the positive things. But the challenges we've got are housing.
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: The Manhattan-era housing. The retail and really, specifically, the mall. And then, the DOE relationship, maximizing that. I, we, they used to be mad at me about 50 percent of the time ... (laughs)
MR. MCDANIEL: Right, right.
MR. BEEHAN: ... for stuff that I thought I was doing, I mean, not mad at me ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Like you're doing, doing ...
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah, they were ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Sure, sure.
MR. BEEHAN: ... sometimes. It was a mixed thing. But ...
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: ... those are the three things, I think.
MR. MCDANIEL: I asked, I was interviewing a lady -- we'll wrap this up.
MR. BEEHAN: Ok.
MR. MCDANIEL: I was interviewing a lady the other day, and she said, we were talking about Oak Ridge, and she said, "You know what we use to say about Oak Ridge?" I said "What's that?" she said, "The two best things about Oak Ridge are the school system and the Soup Kitchen." (laughter) So ...
MR. BEEHAN: I would hope she'd look a little higher.
MR. MCDANIEL: So, those are, those are two pretty good things.
MR. BEEHAN: Well the school system, they are good, they're really good, because ... 
MR. MCDANIEL: Right.
MR. BEEHAN: The Soup Kitchen's right down the street from where I live.
MR. MCDANIEL: Absolutely.
MR. BEEHAN: Where I work.
MR. MCDANIEL: Where you work. 
MR. BEEHAN: Yeah.
MR. MCDANIEL: Well, Tom, thank you so much for taking time to talk with us and to share something about your life, and time in Oak Ridge, and thank you for your service to our community.
MR. BEEHAN: Well you're very welcome, Keith, and I'm very glad you're able to do this, because not many towns are able to do this and this one's very unique.
MR. MCDANIEL: Thank you.
[End of Interview]